RE: Is Hive Watcher's doing a good job?
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If someone is policing the community it should be done by Germans. We have a lot of instinct for order and justice. Most likely the whole thing would get hijacked by some Austrian guy again tho...
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Ja, setzt euch doch bitte auch mal mit für Anti-Abuse ein... (finanziell und zeitlich)
Sehe nur die Selben Leute, welche sich seit immer (sogar noch zu Steem Zeiten) für Anti-Abuse einsetzen.
Würdet ihr euch auch mal einsetze, von eurer freien Zeit und mit euren HP - dann bräuchten wir gar keine Hivewatchers extra zahlen (wir Anti-Abuse Leute haben auch so unsere Probleme mit denen seit Jahren, können es aber auch nicht ändern - sind halt zu wenige)
Ihr wollt Dezentralität jedoch nichts dafür machen, "Gewinne" (Müll Karten & Tokens) jedoch nicht mal für ordentliche Posts Mühe machen - macht sogar noch bei Spam/ jahrelangen Aussaugen der Plattform mit, anstatt sich mal selbst anzustrengen, auf Almosen Gewinne hoffen?
Und wäre es dem Denno wirklich um Unterstützung (also er unterstützt andere) gegangen, würde er sich nicht sofort verabschieden, nachdem nach JAHREN mal ein paar überbewertete "Rewards" ausfallen ^^^^
Er braucht doch keine Rewards um mit seiner HP zu unterstützen ? Hat doch bereits selbst genug bekommen.
Wird Zeit dass sich die Rewards wirklich auf mehr kleinere Accounts (wenn sie sich nun anstrengen, ihre Chance sehen statt rumzuheulen) aufteilen.
Beim Thema Almosen solltest du ganz leise sein. Ich hab dir mal 10 HBD geschickt als ich einen Post von dir gelesen hab in dem du um Geld gebeten hast, obwohl ich dich damals so wie jetzt kaum kenne/kannte. Als nächsten Post durfte ich dann eine Beschwerde lesen, dass zu wenig Leute gespendet haben.
Ich merke schon, um 10 € für Essen zu beten und anzunehmen - transparenter Spendenaufruf auf einer dezentralen Plattform ist wohl sehr viel schlimmer als systematisch diese Plattform auszusaugen (getarnt als "Gewinnspiele" - ohne echten Gewinn - und wortwörtlich tausend-fachen immer gleichen Posts mit dafür vergleichsweise hohen Rewards)
der eine Post schon 1320 mal so rausgehauen und Hive gefarmt :D
Natürlich nicht die komplette HP dadurch erlangt..
Aber wohl scheinbar mittlerweile insgesamt immerhin knapp 17k $
und das gerechnet mit den aktuell miesen Kursen..
die 55k HP bei nem Dollar statt 30ct, wären schon 55k $
Und man findet nicht einen wirklich menschlich/ persönlichen Post von ihm - der ganze Account könnte ein Bot von wem-auch-immer sein :D
Aber ja, nervt mich alle noch halbes Jahrzehnt damit, wie ihr freiwillig mir mal Almosen habt zukommen lassen - heult über das System und die Steuern und unterstützt weiter Scam auf Hive.
Fliegt euch eh mittlerweile alles um die Ohren.
Schöne Grüße
ich fand dennos posts immer super. Eine ganze Weile der einzige Post wo ich einen Kommentar gelassen habe. Manche finden Travelblogs super spannend und ballern da >100$ payouts drauf. Denno macht hier eine Lotterie konsistent für 4 Jahre, jeden Tag. Dutzende von Hivians spielen sie, aber wenn dann mal der Balte das Ding auf 15$ böllert, dann ist es super schlimm oder was?
Und schweigen wir mal über @starthilfe der immer versucht hat die kleinen zu unterstützen, aber benutzt templates für den post = evil.
Hatte von dir nie ne hohe Meinung seit der Aktion damals, aber jetzt seh ich klar. Du bist Abschaum. Verpiss dich von meiner Blockchain und am besten auch aus meinem Land. Sowas wie dich braucht niemand.
Deine Projektion ist klasse :D
Spiegel dir das mal zurück.
Ich bin hier wegen Meinungsfreiheit und Möglichkeiten, nicht wegen solchen wie dir, und was du willst ist mir nicht weiter wichtig,
Alles Beste dir.
Why are you opinion flagging?
Are you trying to kill Hive?
No, but I am close before ignoring you, too
Just for asking me such a dumb question
Where have I flagged opinion?
Why do you front me everywhere?
I dont need that
First read into who you are defending rn (germans who want to abolish downvoting, the self-regulation-mechanism IN GENERAL, hunt people off the plattform and even out of countries)
Ciao customer, I had you better in my memory
That's your flag.
I had thought better of you too.
He want so hunt me off the platform and out of the country
so shut the fuck up, I am allowed to flag fascists like you guys, even defending each other and their fascist actions
while attacking those who defend themselves with flags
maybe we need the "chaos", cuz you dumb dumbs do not understand anarchy
=====
That is not opinion, but blatant fascism
So shut the fuck up
Please continue defending people who want to hunt others away (from the platform and even country) !
You are truly a great part of the community!
Fuck you !
Over and over again you state your desire to silence me, and you even fly opinion flags on my polite comments. Yet you continue to ignore your actions meriting your condemnation, and appear incapable of rational understanding whatsoever.
Because you are blatantly, obviously destroying your credibility and value to anyone with two neurons to rub together, I need to do nothing to defend myself from you, because you are destroying yourself.
Carry on.
Me wanting to be left alone from your hivewatchers projections onto me
IS WANTING TO CENSOR YOU ?
YOU JUST ACHIEVE TO HUNT ME OFF THE PLATFORM
AND ARE IN THE VICTIMHOOD ?
YOU DONT APPEAR TO EVEN KNOW WHAT CENSORSHIP IS
I WIELD NO POWER TO CENSOR YOU
fucking brainless idiot
ALSO
you are "quoting" something, that does not even appear in the quoted comment by me
you are purely projecting
a projecting fascist in victimhood
for clarification, in my:
is no:
bye idiot
yeah, he wants to hunt me off hive and even out of the country
AND YOU CALL IT "FLAGGING FOR OPINION"
you fascists want to tell me what I am allowed to flag
and you want me to stop all efforts for the community (we know since years in the anti-abuse community) and leave, so hunt me away, too
https://peakd.com/hive-104500/@valued-customer/re-woelfchen-sdqp76
I go, you facists have avieched your censorship
keep whining about some words and turning everything around
even @themarkymark sees the farming-sheme by germans for WHAT IT IS
go defend it and watch this platform go bust
join the germans in abolishing downvoting (the decentralized self-regulation mechanism) in general, cuz that is what will follow after the germans achieve the wild-west-downvoting which they sooo fear, after abolishing hivewatcher (cuz their farming sheme got busted)
fuck you
The pic I posted shows that it is not I that am projecting. Take a moment and reflect on the statements I am quoting here revealing that they apply to you, as the pic proves.
You're clearly projecting all over me. You keep telling me what to do, telling me not to speak, and yet claiming I am who is doing those things. I have not. Quote me where I have. What you're doing is projecting the bad things you're doing on me, because then you can feel justified in doing bad things to me. The problem is that I'm not doing those things and you are, which you know subconsciously and this causes your anxiety and fear to increase, which is why you are lashing out in rage, because anger is the child of fear.
It is you that you fear, and your anger is being triggered by your actions. I am concerned you are either in crisis, or have somehow managed to conceal your psychosis for the years that I have followed you, which I don't think is remotely possible given the glaring obvious nature of your present derangement. I don't know your present personal circumstances, but clearly there seems to be some present thing that has triggered you and that is causing you to act in a completely incompetent and pathological way. Please seek some company IRL that you trust and get off the blockchain, where you are leaving proof of your incapacity at present that will not go away.
I am kinda slow, but even I am now aware that something is happening to you that isn't normal for you. Please take some time and enjoy the good personal company of someone you trust, at least so that your time is better spent than spewing useless insults where they don't belong, in the good company of someone you like instead.
stuff it up ur ass, gaslighting manipulating psycho
go over to your german blind followers and defend them openly stating to want to hunt people out of the country
I will continue downvoting that but stop my effort for the community and anti-abuse as you have asked
good luck
wie wäre es, alle selbstvotes, alle curation trails und alles was zum betrug nutzbar ist ab zu schaffen? dann bleibt schon mal nur noch spam und doppelaccounts! aber wer entscheidet was spam ist? ein gewinnspiel was täglich läuft, ist kein spam. wenn es anderen usern spaß macht daran teil zu nehmen und sie freiwillig voten, ist es doch genau das, was hier gefördert werden sollte . wenn der user die votes dazu nutzt, anderen zu helfen, was man ja ganz einfach nachvollziehen kann, so nutzt er weder etwas zum eigenen vorteil, noch betrügt. punkt! und noch etwas. wer beleidigt, anstatt sachlich zu diskutieren, ist immer im unrecht ;-) hier hat sich nämlich langsam eine moralpolizei entwickelt, die entgegen der community handelt, denn wenn ein paar wenige entscheiden, was richtig und falsch ist, dann sind wir beim kommunismus angelangt.
erkläre mir, wo der unterschied bei mir liegt. ob ich auf youtube, oder twitch, oder dlive, oder vimm meinen stream veröffentliche und beim dem "beitrag" user freiwillig voten können. warum wird mir dann eigennutz vorgeworden, obwohl ich noch nie einen cent aus hive abgehoben habe und zumindest per fanbase täglich mehrere votes an andere verteile... wieso kann einer darüber entscheiden, dass das unrecht ist und alles auf 0 voten? wieso muss ich auf seinen willen hin bei anderen kommentieren, obwohl ich das überhaupt nicht möchte, da ich lieber mit usern im stream rede! mit welchem recht? und seine letzten worte waren, ihm gefällt mein content nicht... mir gefällt seiner auch nicht, deswegen vote ich aber niht auf 0 unabhängig davon, dass ich das aufgrund meines accounts ja auch nicht kann. das ist nichts anderes als meinungsdiktatur und machtausspielung.
Hive ist kein Sozialismus-Circlejerk-Projekt
Ansonsten bezüglich dem Rest: Ja! Macht doch!
Schaff eine dezentralere Anti-Abuse Projekt Alternative zu HIveWatchers !
Nutzt eure HP auch zum Bekämpfen von Anti-Abuse !
MACHT
Aber ihr habt euch über Jahre 0, 0 0 0 0 (ausgesprochen: null Komma null null null null)
Für diese Themen eingesetzt - nun wollen viele HW und sogar Downvotes ansich abschaffen, nur um selbst weiter Farmen, die Plattform Abusen zu können.
Egoistischer geht es ja nicht mehr..
Genau deswegen sind die Masse der schlauen Diskutierer zu der Taktik übergegangen - sich einfach wegen jeglicher Kleinigkeit sofort beleidigt zu fühlen und im Anschluss sich somit das Recht erworben zu haben den anderen einfach komplett aus dem Diskurs auszuschließen und direkt mundtot zu machen! wie die echten wissenschaftlichen Faschisten mit ihrem Deutungsmonopol es eben gewohnt sind ;)
@stayoutoftherz
WEIL ER DIE HP HAT?
SO WIE DU VOTEN KANNST WAS DU WILLST, KANN ER DAS AUCH
NUR ER HAT HALT MEHR HP GEKAUFT, ERWORBEN, ERKÄMPFT, VERDIENT, WHATEVER UND DESWEGEN ZÄHLT ES AUCH MEHR ALS EIN 10 HP VOTE
ist doch logisch
Übrigens, genau diesen Downvote-Wilden-Westen kriegen wir wieder, sobald ihr erstmal Hivewatchers abgeschafft habt.
Ich bin auch schon seit JAHREN für ein Abschaffen von Hivewatchers.
Das beantwortet leider gar nichts und du wiederholst dich! ich bin nicht dagegen, downvotes perse ab zu schaffen. aber meiner meinung nach willkürliche downvotes eines einzelnen als bestrafung eines anderen, nur weil ihm das nicht gefällt ;-) nach deiner logik muss ich nur geld einzahlen und habe dann das recht, alles und jeden der mir persönlich nicht passt, auf 0 zu voten. ich habe versucht mit ihm zu reden. wollte konkrete dinge vom ihm erfahren, wie ich den downvotes entgehe. es kam nichts ausser sinnlose sätzt nach dem motto, das müsste ich selbst heraus finden. und zuletzt eben, dass er das nur macht, weil ihm mein content nicht gefällt. ich habe also keinerlei handhabe dagegen.
somit verbrennt er die votes der user, macht meine beiträge weniger sichtbar für andere und auch weniger attraktiv für andere darauf zu voten, wenn sie keinerlei nutzen davon haben. echt super system ;-)
Wenn es um deinen speziellen Fall geht, bräuchte ich schon mehr Infos bezüglich des Kontexts
Hält das weiterhin an oder war das nur mal kurzzeitig und ist schon wieder länger her?
Ah, sehe gerade..
Ich hör mich mal um
Schickst du mir bitte Links dazu, als das Nuke (also auf 0) Downvoting begonnen hat?
Und zu eurer Konversation mit seinen Antworten ?
Schau mal was man machen kann
https://hive.blog/hive-169926/@galenkp/re-rcshad0w-rny2io
https://hive.blog/hive-196037/@rcshad0w/p35omcpvthe#@rcshad0w/rpq88o
https://hive.blog/hive-169926/@galenkp/re-rcshad0w-rnyiho
https://hive.blog/hive-169926/@rcshad0w/3457328eae5902eb5bc73ec1d2bf4937-vimmtv#@rcshad0w/rnyin8
ich will dir die vorgeschichte dazu sagen, da ich nicht unschuldig daran bin und mich auch nicht heraus reden muss.
ich habe damals mehrere post am tag gemacht, mich selbst geupvotet, auch per curation trail. einfach weil mir das egal war. ich habe sowieso nie vor gehabt, hiermit irgend ein einkommen zu erzielen, da ich genug geld mit meiner arbeit verdiene.
da war alles was er gemacht hat auch berechtigt. ob das heute noch so ist kannst du für dich selbst entscheiden, da du ja einsehen kannst, was ich mit meinem account mache. das ganze geht nun ca 1,5 jahre.
noch was zum thema. für mich ist das hivewatchers system absolut undurchsichtig. bis vor kurzem wusste ich nciht mal, das es die gibt. ich weiß nicht wer da mitglied ist. nach welchen konkreten kriterien gewählt wird. wo man sich hinwenden kann, wenn man der meinung ist, dasss es unberechtig ist und wo man konkrete hilfe bekommt, um von denen in ruhe gelassen zu werden. also regelkonform zu posten
Danke.
Ich schaue mal was ich machen kann, habe auch bereits auf Discord die entsprechenden Leute angeschrieben / markiert/ getaggt..
Habe aber das Gefühl ich werde keine Antwort bekommen, ignoriert werden, wohl weil die keine Lust haben sich zu rechtfertigen und für die das Thema abgeschlossen ist..
Möchte natürlich auch nicht nerven (so wie ich wohl auch genervt wäre, wenn Leute auf mich zu kommen und nerven warum ich wen downvote) aber mal sehen..
Versuche auf jeden Fall mal was ich kann..
Kann dir aber nichts versprechen.
Würde dir dann wohl eher empfehlen es mit einem neuen Account zu versuchen.... und diesmal dann nicht einfach ignorierend täglich blind den Inhalt posten.. Vielleicht den Inhalt (Videos) noch etwas mehr einbinden..
Hilfe hättest du von unseren alternativen Anti-Abuse Projekten wie @freezepeach bekommen oder von der jeweiligen Community..
Leider sind die alternativen Anti-Abuse Projekte gescheitert (weil fehlende Teilnahme, Unterstützung und sogar destruktive Reaktionen von den bekannten dummen Communitymigliedern)
und leider ist deine "native" Community auch die faschistische D-A-CH Community, welche sowieso alles ausschließt was ihr nicht passt. (Wie die 3 Affen mit Hände auf Augen, Ohren, Mund)
er votet sogar meine beiträge auf 0
https://hive.blog/hive-121566/@starthilfe/starthilfe-less-than-hivewatcher-keine#@dotwin1981/re-themyscira-2024516t225434417z
https://hive.blog/@rcshad0w/comments
So you support opinion flagging and censorship of the poor?
See, I can disagree with you without censoring you. I think that's a vile opinion, but you have a right to speak it, and my opposition to it can be expressed without censoring your opinion. In fact, I think expressing my opposition to your opinion is vastly more powerful than censoring you, because expressing my views contrary to yours can enable others to agree with me, which will benefit everyone that considers both our views.
Censorship is weakness. Your flags are weakness.
Shut up
Everyone can do with their HP how they like - that is a fact
They can circlejerk and others can downvote them for that.
Just because they have the HP, THEY ARE FREE TO DO WITH THEIR HP
SO AS THE GERMANS ONLY CIRCLEJERK
So are you defending circlejerks and abusers?
And try to VERBIETEN bigger accounts to flag that?
So you support censorship of big investors?
DO YOU WANT TO KILL HIVE ?
(I am only asking these dumb questions, cuz you asked me them - it is part of the reflection)
Bye
That's just chaos. The law of the jungle, and has no potential to create a functional society - which I reckon the present state of Hive demonstrates well. That's what's been killing Hive instead of enabling it to outcompete highly censored and propaganda spewing Big Social Media. That's the problem. If the code enables it, it's all ethical and productive, right? Except the code also permits scams and sniffers to snag exposed keys, so by your standards those things should be just fine too.
There need to be rules that restrict individual freedom in society in order for society to be anything other than a cannibal holocaust. Hive needs to rationally secure free speech or remain redolent of the stench of censorship it reeks of across the cryptosphere now. Even Reddit has more users. Opinion flags that have driven ~1M users off the platform - which is more than 100x the users presently on board - glaringly reveal an almost suicidal level of self-harm to the platform from censorship. It's hard to conceive of worse management performance of a social media platform, particularly one that introduced getting paid by curators to blog just as social media was becoming the largest financial sector in global markets.
Frankly, I have to suspend disbelief to think it isn't deliberate suppression.
You are just a projecting piece of shit asshole
Good luck !
SHOW ME
You talking shit about me: your PROJECTION
is a weakness
I have only flagged if people insulted me or even have directly threatened me with violence and want to chase me out of Hive and the country (Germany)
So
PLEASE
SHUT THE FUCK UP
https://peakd.com/hive-104500/@thatgermandude/re-woelfchen-sdhjhq
Keep lying about me and defending those who even threaten with violence and you get your flags from me!
Bye
Gasp! Clearly, muting isn't enough. Perhaps nuclear weapons should be considered. You also might have a look at your statements to me above and compare it to what you're claiming is intolerable speech you have to censor.
You're off your hook, man. Get a grip.
I dont give a fuck about fascists or people who support fascists (I have my problem with the german community since YEARS, which you have no clue about)
So shut the fuck up
or I'll stop doing anything for this asshole platform
(am even still currently helping community member of that fascist community
https://peakd.com/hive-104500/@woelfchen/re-rcshad0w-sdqgty
But you can get more on my nerves like the fascists asshole supporter you are, and I will stop)
Censorship.
Yay!
Given the choice between your vilification and nothing, I would obviously prefer nothing from you at all. Please mute me so your incessant triggering no longer disturbs my peace and sanctity, or that of Hive, and we can get on with the business of creating felicitous society without the impediment of your counterproductive screeching, nonsensical rants, and baseless ad hominems.
You are as dumb as the germans, who do not even know WHAT CENSORSHIP EVEN IS.
You talk about baseless ad hominems and support fascists, who exclude one from the "scientific" discourse, silence you, defame you, even go so far as to want to chase you off the platform and out of your own country
You call me evil, cuz I defend myself
Just shut up with your complete nonsense and leave me alone, asshole
Continue whining about my use of free speech to defend myself, about my use of MY HP to counter their circle-jerking, self-voting, farming of bot-account rewards for literally the SAME POST FOR YEARS abusing the reward pool, and also just their fascistic behaviour
Go on with your projection, you are not better than the dumb germans, thinking I was some Hivewatcher insider
WHILE YOU KNOW I AM AGAINST HIVEWATCHER SINCE ITS INCEPTION
you back-stabbing piece of asshole fascists scum
If you think your vile mischaracterizations of me or anyone else, replete with vulgar ad hominems and bizarre claims of oppression (I have never, ever downvoted you), are defending you, you are quite mistaken.
Nothing I say can attack you. What I say is useful to judge me by.
It is your words, your libel, your lies, vulgarity, and utter incomprehension that you are judged by. You are your worst enemy. I am actually doing my very best to help you understand this, so that you can act to refrain from destroying your credibility and empathy from anyone that is bored enough to read our exchanges. I am explaining how your speech is revealing who you are, so that you can say things that merit respect.
I am actually quite shocked. I really am wondering if you are having a crisis, some kind of psychotic break that may be endangering you or those around you. I have never imagined such behaviour coming from you, and I have followed you for years. It is extremely bizarre, and I hope you have a good social network and can get the help you need.
LOL
but you claim I have censored you
it is pointless, you support the fascists wanting to push me out (of platform AND COUNTRY)
you liar have now achieved that I stop all efforts regarding community & anti-abuse
do it alone
with your fascist friends and psychosis, hivewatcher, whatever projections
i am leaving, you and the fascists have won
Goodbye
AS IF I HAD THE POWER TO CENSOR YOU
WHERE ?
YOU ARE JUST A PIECE OF SHIT WITH PROJECTIONS
LOL
SO YOU SUPPORT ABUSING THE PLATFORM; FARMING REWARDS; CALL FASCISTS "THE POOR"; STAB INTO THE BACK OF VOLUNTARY OLD ANTI-ABUSE COMMUNITY MEMBERS?
I already know the answer
Yes, why don't you join us in the effort for anti-abuse... (financially and in terms of time)
I only see the same people who have always (even in Steem times) contributed to anti-abuse.
If you would also use your free time and your HP - then we wouldn't have to pay extra for hivewatchers (we anti-abuse people have also had our problems with them for years, but we can't change it either - there are just too few of us -> so a need for hivewatchers).
You don't want to do anything for decentralisation, but you don't even want to make an effort for proper posts - you even participate in spam/years of sucking the platform dry instead of making an effort yourselves, hoping for little crap "wins"?
And if Denno was really interested in support (i.e. he supports others), he wouldn't immediately say goodbye after a few overvalued "rewards" are cancelled after YEARS ^^^^
He doesn't need rewards to support others with his HP? He's already got enough himself.
It's about time that the rewards are really distributed to more smaller accounts (if they make an effort and see their chance instead of whining now).
well you critized something else so let me respond to that.
I dont mind organisation. I think well organising something and giving people a payment or reward for their effort is not a bad thing. Organsiation is not in conflict with decentralisation and not even anarchism itself - at least not on a principle level.
Im also not against the Wild West solution, where everybody flags and even common folks downvote stuff they think is overrated/overpayed. I would make a morning routine out of downvoting 90% of the trending page and I would have a jolly time doing so. Even though I actually think this would be the best solution Im surely not the one who will try to make it trend.
organized farming of the hive reward pool ?
Of course, he didn't get the full HP from it.
But apparently a total of just under $17k in the meantime
and that calculated with the current lousy exchange rates...
the 55k HP with a dollar price instead of 30ct would already be 55k $
organized farming by posting the same post now the 1320th time (he even numbered it :D) getting a few hive for giving out 1 hive (HSBI) or win games where one wins worthless tokens and cards?
And you can't find one really human/personal post from him - the whole account could be a bot from whoever :D
best "marketing" for outside viewer - a big circlejerk
and blind people supporting scammers who exploit them, their own supporters/ fans/ friends
by giving them crumbles for farming rewards
good luck
"getting a few hive for giving out 1 hive (HSBI)"
setzen sechs!
Schau nochmal nach und ich hoffe, dass du dich dann zumindest ein klein wenig bei @kryptodenno entschuldigst.
Über etwas herziehen, sich das aber noch nicht mal genau angucken.
Und um sicherzugehen, dass du richtig nachschaust, bitte hier einmal auflisten, was es alles gibt!
Erinnert mich ein klein wenig an das hier (von wegen nicht lesen):
https://www.spiegel.de/netzwelt/netzpolitik/datenschutz-website-belohnt-leser-mit-gratis-wein-a-4c8e4e63-dc86-480b-bd21-5f96c118210a
Erklär mir doch mal, wozu Hivewatcher Stündlich 12 HBD bekommt? Also das ist mal die Community schröpfen!
Wieso soll ich mir euren Müll genauer anschauen - ihr seid bei mir alle unten durch.
Euch fliegt eh alles um die Ohren.
Hivewatchers ist auch schon länger ein Problem - SEIT JAHREN..
Ihr seid halt auch einfach mal wieder mega spät dran. Und einfach allen Anti-Abuse abzuschaffen ohne euch für neuen (besseren, dezentralen - kann ja jeder Flaggen) einzusetzen - wird diese Plattform töten.
Doch von sowas habt ihr keinen Plan und interessiert euch auch nicht. Ihr wollt bloß eure paar Farming Rewards, und die Scammer noch viel mehr...
Ich bin auch kein Teil von Hivewatchers. Ich wurde das halbe Jahrzehnt nie für meinen Einsatz bezüglich Anti-Abuse (auch in der deutschen DACH Community) belohnt - im Gegenteil, nur geächtet, von euch unfair behandelt gefühlten, egoistischen Dämonen.
Viel Glück beim Lernen
Weil du darüber herziehen, wenn du das machst, dann beschäftige dich damit.
Ich dachte Hive ist eine Plattform für so ziemlich alles und die Community entscheidet, was ein Upvote und was ein Downvote wert ist. Aber dem ist nicht so, es sind nur ein paar wenige.
Wie man an der Umfrage sehen kann, 100% dagegen.
Proposal hat lediglich etwas über 100 Votes, leider von paar Mächtige.
Im Gegensatz dazu haben andere Proposals mehrere hundert oder gar tausende Votes. Und leider bekommen aber diese Teils dennoch nichts.
290 am Tag, wofür? Selbst 29 am Tag wären mehr als Ausreichend!
Habs nicht überprüft, aber wenn lediglich 20$ Downvotes am Tag erfolgen, dann sind das 270 $ die Sinnlos raus geworfen werden und für gabz anderes genutzt werden sollten.
Beschäftige du dich doch mal damit.
Wir wollen Hivewatchers seit JAHREN dezentralisieren.
Aber ihr interessiert euch nicht für Anti-Abuse
Ihr wollt die Plattform selbst für euch ausnutzen.
Viel Glück mit eurer Hirnlosigkeit.
Beschäftige dich mal wirklich selbst mit dem dezentralen Selbstregulierungsmechanismus - dann würdest du niemals Downvotes grundsätzlich abschaffen wollen.
Hast jetzt erstmal paar Wochen was zu tun.
Viel Glück - bin jetzt wirklich raus, das ist hier einfach komplett sinnlos.
Ihr seid eh nur in eurer Projektion und denkt wohl auch noch ich wäre HW
LOL
Lern mal Lesen du Affe
Lern du mal lesen!
Was steht unter dem was du markiert hast?
Und dann guck dir die Posts mal an die davor waren.
Aber Hauptsache beleidigen
And? If you don't like the game, don't play.
I don't like the game, so I don't play. Problem solved. Why do you feel like you should be able to tell others what content to enjoy?
I can downvote what I want
And I havent even downvoted, while I have been downvoted by them for TALKING
Even if I start downvoting now, I am free to do so
So get your facts right
fucking fascists, wanting to abolish the self-regulation mechanism of hive, down-votes in general
go to fucking blurt you pieces of brainless shit
tell that the germans who only joined 3 days ago to abolish HW, just cuz their farming sheme got busted
They play the game and now WHINE cuz others busted their farming game.
So do you want to be able to tell other big HP Stakes what farming sheme abuse they are allowed to downvote and what not?
These germans are even so dumb:
I am also for abolishing HW, it is just not a new topic (since few days) for me
These dumb germans do not know, that we will get wild-west-downvoting again as soon as HW is being abolished
wild-west-downvoting is what the germans fear the most
Let's go !
But shut the fuck up about me, or join the dumb germans, you could match pretty good
You refer to sock puppets. They aren't n00bs. The HW crew and censorship ring that supports them are clearly massively funded, and those with the most substantial stake are who has the thousands and thousands of socks.
Sadly, I don't even speak German.
Ich lese auch kein Deutsch
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Abolish hiveWatchers
LOL
Ordnung is not the basis for freedom, but rather Austrian jackboot fetishists. There does need to be order, but rather the order of the Goths than Romans. Freedom of speech has created the longest enduring societies the world has ever seen, starting millennia ago with the expansion of the Yamnaya that burst out of the steppes by inventing dairy and the economic advantage that provided.
Such invention is only facilitated by free speech, and demonstrates that it is free speech that is far more valuable than mere money.
Thanks!
Ordnung muss sein! :)
It is that supposed principles are being constantly contradicted, which are first proclaimed loudly and proudly and then broken with a downvote for not being able to stomach insults or differentiating opinions. On whim.
When I opened my Steemit account it was advertised with "you get paid to blog" and with "free speech", their unique selling points.
However, it cannot credibly advertise itself and later Hive as such, as free speech is prevented here just as it is elsewhere. Not through downvotes per se, but by promoting mainstream content. What you see on trending is what counts and is consumed mostly.
Since no clear set of rules is communicated centrally, there are no clear rules. For example, you have to get to know HW before you know what function it fulfils.
For me, Hive is an example of what happens when you create a space where people who have nothing to do with each other try their hand at politics. Since there are no familial, local or business relationships between them, the only currency is the attention currency. If you're not conjuring up the end of the world (extreme on one side) or drawing a utopia (extreme on the other), you remain a barely read user. Which I do not mind personally (IF I have a steady readership of a handful of people) but that's how online-activity seems to be understood.
Everything else is mediocre entertainment as a matter of fact.
People say that every user has to be a plagiarism/spam police. But the fact is that most people don't want to do that, which is understandable when you put into perspective how much time it takes to do just that.
The ludicrous thing about the situation is that if someone posts spam in large quantities, the payouts first have to be visible in order to be noticed, for example trending. But if they now appear on the trending page, it means that they already have high payouts. I would say that spam usually doesn't trend, but then spam is hard to find. So it's just a coincidence if you come across a spammer account.
I wouldn't downvote a spammer if I come across one, since it cannot be done by just one glimpse and then push a button. So you need a police. Who then reports violation to a mature committee, who then contacts the suspect, who then have a talk, who then clear the case. All of it must be transparent and not behind the scenes, as you rightly pointed out. The payment for the police and the committee must be worth the time and work invested. The documentation of the executives must be well written and thoroughly done by the best standards. The police ought not be the judges, only the ones who refer supposedly spammers and plagiarists to the committee.
Since "spam" isn't crystal clear either, some whales downvote posts that simply have a picture plus a little text as spam. Opinions can be divided here.
The users then complain because countless of them actually have no awareness at all that what they publish maybe regarded as totally unimportant rubbish. Only when you get to know a user do you begin to understand what their "one picture plus two lines" could mean. For example with antisocialist.
But of course, there ARE just rubbish postings who could as well be AI-supported content. One never knows before one does not engage on a one-on-one basis. So I would say people are not payed for their content but for being known (becoming acquainted to each other) through engagement over a longer course of time. It's relational.
If someone is not interested at all in building a relation towards his audience, it can mean (but not for sure) that he gives a damn. But you never know. Sometimes people want to share what they find important in an open space. And, as you say, value free speech more than payout. But it can't be helped, since the payout is in the first place what generates attention. So, free speech is linked to high payouts.
I have often experienced the politicians on this platform (witnesses) saying that they really don't want to debate with every single user, which is "exactly why downvotes and upvotes are distributed". But that's still what they should and are expected to do, as they are perceived as politicians and set themselves up as such.
But if you are in such a mood that you don't really want to have anything to do with the tedious work of a politician because it is supposedly enough to press buttons, you end up with a user base that presses buttons. The whole design is geared towards button-pushing and because of this, witnesses refuse to do anything other than push buttons. They justify it by saying that it saves time and the statement itself is enough for people to find buttons pressed on their post, representing either a thumbs up or a thumbs down. The whole nature of the algorithm is geared towards this.
"Saving time" and automating the very processes in which people actually can come to an understanding towards each other, is an illusion. Time cannot be saved, since conflict cannot be avoided. Avoiding conflict means to push buttons instead of debating.
It's an illusion to think that pushing buttons represent engagement since it doesn't. So, they can be believed in saying that they don't want to debate with every single user. But then, they cannot place a downvote either, if they refuse to talk to that specific user who received their downvote. That is a contradiction. They are expected to invest personal time and arguments. If they don't like it, they cannot be a witness, and should remove themselves from the witness list.
One person cannot talk to many people at the same time, that's true. Each individual can only have a conversation with a handful of people. If you violate this insight, you succumb to the misconception that this truth can be replaced by pressing buttons. It can't.
My goodness you are lucid! I am so glad I get the benefit of your considerations.
Aside from some expectations of witnesses I don't think are mete, I vehemently agree with most every word you have written here, and didn't know I did until you said it.
Hey! You do read my posts! LOL
Gah. This truth sticks in my craw. Nonetheless, it is true, so I'm choking it down. As much as I don't want a 'police', sorting plagiarism and tracking spam takes resources that require dedication mere content consumers aren't providing, and can't. What that means is that HW and Marky are understaffed (and HW is overpaid because of it), and there needs to be - as others have mentioned as well - a formal statement of what is and isn't spam, plagiarism, AI generated content, and so forth, and teams of competent people to serve in the various roles necessary to properly execute policing functions.
I don't know what the procedures have been heretofore, but when scams arise, actual police may legally be required to be informed.
You have substantially changed my perspective on this matter, and I cannot thank you enough for doing so. I hate being wrong, and now that I agree with you I am right again! But, can we have juries of our peers instead of professional committees or judges? I agree we need competent investigation and detection, but there will be matters of judgment, and it seems to me that juries are a strongly justified mechanism for rendering judgment, guilt or innocence, upon presentation of professional investigation and defense by the accused.
Also, once you have institutions, you get corruption. The professional police and investigation committees are going to be infiltrated by scammers seeking to influence investigations, so they can get away with scams. Juries are much more resistant to institutional corruption that judges and police IME.
Thanks!
HaHa! LoL :D - you know that I do.
However you recruit them, this is the weakest point in the matter.
To have non corruptible people, you'd actually would have to refer to the already existing organs outside of hive. But since hive is a globally working sphere, you'd have the executive and judiciary/jury positions according to the location of the involved. But if you have a party from England and one from Venezuela, you have a problem.
In order to meet conflict in a proper way, you need all three: the police to report suspects, a mediator group (arbitrator), and, if mediating does not work, a judge and a jury (while I do not see a jury needed in all cases). You cannot have those people from within the Hive network, since they would be in conflict with their interest. Since they are all stakeholders (getting paid for content creation).
To have outside-people getting involved, you'd actually would need real mediators and real police and real judges since you cannot be any of it, if that is not your education and profession - so people who ARE those pros and do hive as a hobby, for example. Everyone could be a jury member but then you'd have to sit by in a led process, which again, must be led by a professional. And accept HBD for compensation.
Having said all this, I see that almost nobody here is professionally educated in those fields. I am myself a consultant and have a bit experience in mediating, but probably wouldn't want to do it here professionally, since HBD/HP as compensation is not attractive enough.
Maybe, I would do a mediation process once a year for the fun and experience of it. But I would need, before anything, an official mandate from the conflicting parties - and they would have to accept that I probably would have a conflict of interest myself - LoL. There is a certain and strict protocol for mediating a conflict (for very good reasons). If you are interested, I dig in the basement of my steemit blogsite to pull one article out.
I don't see any conflict of interest. Outside Hive every jury member uses fiat. Juries on Hive using it's tokens aren't any more of a conflict of interest.
Seems to me that would cause them to more diligently judge carefully their peers, zealous to both defend the innocent (to make sure they're not judged unfairly themselves if they are falsely accused) as well as get scammers and malicious parties cured or censored. That's the point of juries of peers: folks that have a vested interest in justice, not kangaroo courts or pats on the backside for hazards to the community.
No one would better be able to investigate scams and etc. than Hive members that are competent to use the features of the front ends and platform, and only in cases of actual crimes, like theft and fraud, would outside authorities be necessary to bring in. Frankly, like all insular communities, I'd prefer to handle our business in house.
By the time we get to mediation, we should have a good understanding of the facts of the matter, which a proper adjudication metric should provide appropriate guidelines to a jury to implement.
So you're saying that jury members would have no conflict whatsoever as stakeholders in a cryptocurrency with the subject matter of what would be negotiated?
I am building up a case in my mind, to follow my thoughts on this...
Let's say you were prosecuting a case in some country where some stranger to the jury was accused of spamming. The company making the accusation would be some local social media platform in Germany, for example a forum for computer games. None of the jury members would have a monetary stake in this company because the company offers no possibility of monetary participation. None of them know the senior operators of this company and have never come into contact, either directly or indirectly.
What would be negotiated would be the accusation of inadmissible spamming on the sites accessible to the public.
What is the likelihood that the individuals on the jury would be guided by a financial interest, because it is said that the operation of the platform suffers financial and reputational damage as a result of spamming? The probability would not be given. The defendant would not have this specific financial motivation either.
The jury would be asked by the accuser to take the interest of the company into account, of course. The defendend would argue that the spamming accusation is not correct, because .... and so on and so forth.
If you now take Hive as that social media platform, where every opened account requires at least some stake, and where participation and engagement with other users is highly dependent on building up stake in order to become more visible, and in order to make ones own votes more attractive, and where the financial stability of the currency is linked to its success, and where participants use downvotes in order to counteract what they think is "damaging" the platform, but nowhere it is defined and can be looked up as a central rule what exactly is to be understood by "damage", that those jury members can come in no conflict with what they think about the matter of spam, the matter of the reward pool, the matter of downvotes themselves?
I would define that as a probability to come into conflict between my interest as a hive user and the interest of another hive user, would you not?
Personally, I don't think the point of using jurors is for them to be zealous. Rather, I think that because jurors are randomly selected (as I interpret your US law), they are considered a fair representation of the average citizen because they are allowed to have as little to do with the case presented to them as possible.
As I understand it, it would promote a conflict if jury members were, for example, shareholders in the company that a person accused of harming the company. So if by chance a person was selected who worked in the company or held shares in it, they would be excluded from the trial, I think.
Where I live, in the Pacific Northwest, there are company towns, where the entire population of a town works for one company, usually logging companies. They don't have any option to exclude jurors for working for the company the accused also works for (if they're a local). I believe that the reason the jury system works so well is that jurors are indeed zealous to ensure the rights of the accused are respected by the legal process, that the prosecution does effectively prove beyond a shadow of a doubt their guilt, or to conserve the rights of the juror by voting not guilty if the prosecution does not meet that bar. People are indeed zealous of the felicity of their village or town, because their family depends on it, and don't want criminals to prey on themselves, or their friends, family, neighbors because that threatens themselves and their family. Juries are motivated to judge truly and justly because of these factors.
You've painted a very specific picture here. You come from the perspective that having a vested interest is THE requirement for judging over a case. Now, this interest is here the locality and familiarity as well as the dependency on a company which feeds the town.
I agree that what I would call determination (not zeal) to judge fairly may take place. IF the logging company IS seen as a valuable enterprise for the whole area. But the question would be, what point of accusation towards a single townsperson could such a company make, arguing that its stability or very existence was in jeopardy?
To be in jeopardy as a company through a damaging act by an individual, I can only imagine that it would be a case of a powerful individual (journalist, for example) who tries to damage the logging companies reputation. Then this journalist must have a lot of power (which usually is not the case if you are acting individually, but collectively). Since badmouthing a company by individuals in private usually does not harm the company in total.
I actually didn't say that it was necessary to juries. What I did say, or meant to say, was that interest improved the ability of juries to judge because it caused their attention to be sharp and focused, and their interest aligns with actual justice.
Anyway, I don't think juries are magical. They certainly reflect their societies, which includes the bad with the good.
Alright. Thanks for clarifying.
True.
Have you ever been a member of a jury yourself? Or do you know someone who was?
We don't have that in Germany. What we have, is this:
Unfortunately, the wiki-entry does not translate into English. If you are interested, you must translate it yourself. I wasn't knowing about the "Schöffen" myself. I only knew the word and vaguely what it could mean. I was surprised when I read that you can act as a lay judge in court and that your vote actually counts just as much as that of a professional judge.
Well, juries in the US can actually rule that the law is the problem, not actions of the defendant. It's called Jury Nullification, and judges hate, hate, hate it. They often caution juries, dismiss attorneys, and start trials over if jury nullification is mentioned. They've even muzzled defendants so they can't speak out of order at trial. American juries are yet one of the most powerful vestiges of actual democracy left in the country, since voting at the national level is merely a ritual and ballot box stuffing or burning the ballots of the challenging candidate tend to decide elections where more than a few million dollars are spent on the contest. Small local elections are both more effective in controlling local polities, and more likely to be decided by the actual voters, because there's less money involved, and teams of ballot farmers cost too much.
Thus, when the wrong candidate gets in office and passes bad laws, juries have authority to nullify such laws during trials of people accused of breaking them, as well as declare the defendant guilty or not guilty. I think very highly of juries, but have been disappointed with jurors, because so many of them aren't very competent to understand technical issues, are bamboozled by their indoctrinations and propaganda, or aren't very attentive or courageous when human rights are violated by laws and courts.
I have been on juries, which is where I formed my opinion.
That is very interesting. I didn't know about Nullification. That's a great tool to counteract stupid laws. I would be interested in statistics, how often it happened that Nullification was successful. Is this ever in the media?
Yeah, I bet that this is not very well received from those who are in full line with none sensical regulations.
People here in my country who do not abide by the law, sometimes hope that someone accuses them and then a trial in court takes place. That is, of course, a high risk that your case will be judged against you.
It tells a lot about the state of affairs if those very tools to put things in balance are neither known nor often enough used.
I was attending a trial not so long ago and the result was disappointing since the judge decided against the woman accused. But what was worth it for me to watch it was that I saw how the judge actually struggled with the case and said some things which impressed me. It was obvious to me that he actually would have liked to decide in favour of the defendant, but couldn't find the courage to do so.
But when the prosecutors responded to his questions to them in such a way that they thought the defendant was guilty from the outset and it became obvious that they did, he became quite annoyed and told them: "If that's the case, that you want to ignore what you've heard here, we could save ourselves any trial!" He did indeed say a few other intelligent things, but on the whole it was not enough to secure an acquittal. He tried hard to work the prosecutors so that they could have done the difficult task of dropping the charges (which would obviously have been the best solution for him), but finally, after four tough sessions, he did what he did.
However, it was important for me to witness this live and to realise that things are often not as black and white as we see them from a distance.
Almost never, first because the courts suppress to the degree possible that power juries have, and because the media are utterly craven traitors that make every effort to impose the worst despotism humanity has ever suffered, and therefore suppress useful information and means people can employ to repair and reclaim their government.
Having said all this and having talked to themarkymark in this comment thread (and others before him), I think that the witnesses don't hold themselves accountable for giving rules, since they seem to think that the so called white paper says it all.
Since the analogy of a crab bucket is used, they are more or less saying, that the so called community (each and every single individual crab) rules. That can be translated to "every one rules". But if everyone rules, then no one rules. A place cannot be ruled by everyone.
If that is believed, rules are not there. What IS there is personal individual whim, taste, opportunism, hostility, sympathy, pity.
Since the witnesses say that they cannot give any clear rules because of "decentralization" they will not give out any clear rule to which they (as well as every one else) can be held accountable. Because accountability would be something all actors could refer to. But when you have no reference and no authority, arguing and negotiating becomes futile. Every virtue signaling becomes futile.
Indeed, this is the case.
In the broader context the illusion exists as a phenomena, that there is no authority but one's own, that there is no objectivity but only subjectivity, the individual is condemned to look only at himself as a reference and to neglect perspectives (and facts) from a point of view other than his own, the resultant error turns the many individuals into a righteous mob that believes it can exercise authority based on the individual's presumed sense of justice by means of the sole point of view AND immediate, not thorough, thought.
When the focus is taken away from the power that issues regulations (but not rules), because the issuers no longer feel responsible for their actions, they have rid themselves of any vulnerability.
Although they act as shells for permanent top-down regulation of individual issues (which are available as an inexhaustible pool), they then raise their hands and say: We have placed the issue in your hands, so may you now resolve the conflict with each other (not with us), which we have prepared the ground for but which is beyond our control.
They act like a confectioner who takes an existing successful recipe for sand cakes and says: "From now on, it is forbidden to use flour for sand cakes. Anyone who uses flour anyway and is reported by those who have accepted the use of flour as criminal is confronted with the act of litigation."
And one is no longer allowed to ask how it can be that the pastry chef decides that flour can no longer be used for sand cakes. But this pastry chef points his finger at those who have accepted “flour is forbidden” and says: “Well, if I'm so wrong, why do your accusers think exactly like me?"
Basically, the legislator seem not to care what happens next.
Since he has stripped himself of his own authority - the ability to make careful considerations - to know what is needed or not needed, and to be careful with law-making anyway. He simply enacts one "law" after another because he thinks that is what is expected of him (listening only to the doomsday sayers or the utopian shouters - through the use of the screen).
But this cannot be a reasonable expectation, because a law cannot be responsible for all people and all situations and should only be invoked when there is no other alternative.
But where the legislator pretends that there is no alternative from the outset and that the actors under his alleged authority do not and cannot know anything about alternatives, he is basically saying: I am the law and I know that my law has no alternative. But if you as a people disagree, you must be able to prove it and if you can't prove it, you will be punished/must submit.
I believe this is classically referred to as “proof reversal”.
This means that individuals no longer have to assume their innocence in principle, but rather has been put as principally guilty, and must first prove their innocence.
But to whom? The individual cannot address the legislator directly. One individual has to produce a conflict with some other individual (or company) which proves the regulation wrong (and the "law" as well). Or, the individual turns to a political party which still wants to listen and debate and is in opposition to the ruling party.
Which motivates me full circle to say that "ruling" legislators seem to have turned into an irresponsible bunch who believe in nothing higher than themselves.
That is a problem with Legislatures. Once you have 10 commandments, you don't need more commandments, but legislators are paid to create laws, so they keep creating commandments that are not only unnecessary, but - because each law criminalizes an action, create breaches of these unjust laws that are treated as crimes - are actually crimes themselves.
I don't recall the actual statistics, but the various jurisdictions in the US create a stack of laws head high yearly, all of which further deprecate freedom and are crimes because they are unjust. Worse, corruption inevitably infests institutions, and some laws are intended to be crimes crooked legislators effect because they're bribed or blackmailed to do so, using saving children, terrorists, or smth to justify their enactment.
After a couple centuries this pile of tyrannies and oppressions really stacks up and turns a free country into a totalitarian despotism that societies either destroy, or are destroyed by. I reckon this is the reason we see specific evils repeated in history, despite the obvious malignance and eventual outcomes of those evils (revolution, hanging crooked politicians from lamp posts, etc.). Since each evil isn't part of some overall master plan to attain anything but some benefit desirable to the corrupters, the holistic concatenation of these evils isn't a goal, but tends to be arrived at consistently anyway.
Weimar Germany, Justinian Byzantium, and the West today all strikingly resemble one another in the specific degeneracies and lapses of just governance that degrade them, and we should not be surprised when the West ends up being resolved in the same way Byzantium, Weimar Germany, and similar degenerate states have been.
However, the technological capabilities of human society do not simply cycle. While polities rise from chaos and proceed to repeat the political cycle, technology only infrequently is reset to the Stone age. Technological advance may pause when polities being reset prevents continued development temporarily, the tech capabilities don't reset to zero, but advance from where they were when they paused.
Decentralization of means of production is quite obviously the cutting edge of every field of industry today. Dispersing production of goods and services across the population dramatically changes the dynamic of power in society. Where overlords have been necessary to manage centralized production for millennia, because the machinery of production has required collective human labor to make it work, when automation enables individuals, or much smaller and more easily managed groups, like individual households, overlords are not only no longer necessary, they are repugnant because they are so expensive.
For example, a movie studio that makes a surfer movie using the big film cameras used in the 60s has huge crews and needs expensive lawyers. Today a surfer with a gopro has no need of expensive lawyers, and would find the claim of the bar that he needed to spend $1m/year on retainers absolutely intolerable. This isn't merely some utopian fantasy. Across every field of industry this is the restructuring being undertaken today, as 3D printers, aquaponics, mesh networks, printable electronics, and the variety of automated means of production available to individuals burgeon and develop.
Add to that the increased productivity of the most advanced technology in each of the fields, such as cooking. In the Stone age you made flour by grinding grain between rocks by hand. For millennia this was the way to make flour, with gradual increases in industrial capacity from a woman with a mortar and pestle being the state of the art to Roman water powered mills built in a row along a flowing stream. Then the industrial revolution introduced the steam engine, and manufacturing capacity advanced from steam donkeys to the digitally controlled electric motors flour mills owned by corporations have today.
However the advent of household grain mills makes it unnecessary to buy bleached enriched flour from corporations that grow GMO grain doused in biocides. People can massively improve the quality of the flour they eat - which has become not just a benefit, but an existential need, because all that bleaching, enriching, and dousing is chemically castrating us to the point that testosterone has plummeted, and fertility has dropped below replacement levels. This means that people that buy or grow organic grain and grind it themselves have a massive advantage over people that buy flour from corporations, because they aren't chemically neutered and successfully breed, while people that do buy flour from overlords go extinct.
Because flour isn't the only source of such chemical pollution, people that take advantage of the most advanced technology which eliminates waste and expenses specific to centralization also gain the most benefit from the products they make themselves, because they make bespoke products exactly to their specifications, rather than mass produced crap that just gets jammed into their use case, and all the myriad ways chemical pollution gets into our diets and environment are reduced across the board. For instance I make my own toothpaste, deodorant, and other household products that don't have emulsifiers, plasticizers, or detergents in them, dramatically reducing the chemical pollution I am exposed to.
In toto, the increased benefit people and societies gain from decentralization isn't merely quantitative, but is qualitative in that it is the difference between reproductive success and failure, between freedom and slavery, between felicity and penury. Because decentralization and automation advance every field of industry this isn't just a minor change, like from land line telephones to mobile phones, but a dramatic evolution of society that is deprecating the master/slave system to replace it with freeholds of peers.
Then add the nascent advent of access to resources that aren't on Earth, like asteroid Psyche, worth ~$1Q (one quadrillion dollar). Because we can automate production of sealed environments, print solar panels, create closed loop ecologies with aquaponics that create food, water, and air, and etc., and today spacecraft are being 3D printed, the obvious result is going to be a diaspora of free people able to provide everything they need themselves to wherever valuable resources are they can develop. Because of the paradigm of centralized hierarchies depends on the entire hierarchy focusing it's abilities on the orders of the overlord, institutions like corporations, governments, and armies aren't capable of conquering and ruling diasporas. Diasporas may have little military power in each of the disparate points, but because they are managed independently there is no central point of failure an army can conquer and thereafter control the diaspora.
IOW, the rule of overlords and polities is becoming impossible, and free people will become prosperous beyond my ability to conceive as they spread out across the universe. I hope that makes more sense than my prior doom/utopian posts have. It's simply evolution of capabilities happening across the board transcending a clinal boundary, and creating new environmental conditions that are dramatically different than existed before.
Right. I often thought that one can judge every case of conflict from those very principles.
I agree very much that people become more aware of the absurdities, the more they are in their face, and that humans are ingenious in how to handle problems on their own. Becoming knowledgable and skilled in what one needs as existential tools and foods though requires time and practice, and people who can teach that kind of skills. It looks often enough like a race against time.
We need each other on every front, not only the technological one (of which there is not much I can add) but also on the political front, the cultural, the spiritual etc. - I yet have still to decide whom to join and what I am going to do with the time I have.
I talk more to people here locally, to those whom I meet in their work places , for example. Yesterday I talked to one member of a party who was on promotion tour with his colleagues, because of an upcoming election. These are local politicians, and it was good to hear from an insider what they have to say and what is going on in their minds, and what they think they already have achieved. We've talked for about an hour, I was actually on my way to do groceries. I can't give you a summary of the content, it was just too much we've touched upon.
Since I am in touch with people around me, and since I am more content with myself, I actually get along so much better with other humans than ever before, which also has to do with the fact that I became more confident in expression and what I believe is true. Same with remaining friends (the little I have). All of them appear so different from the folks I used to be with, that I hardly can believe it. There are indeed many intelligent people out there.
So yeah, let's not become hopeless, and instead do what everyone can.
LoL! Mostly it did. I am sorry that I am not directly responding to what you have talked about in detail. I am simply not competent enough to talk about the technology related stuff. My skills lay elsewhere.
I am so glad that you got it!
People think of themselves that they can be anything in one person:
a police officer, an arbitrator, a judge, a juror AND an ethically mature person. That is impossible. In oder being all of them you'd need 20 years of education and still you could't do it in one person, since that is insane.
AHA
NOW WHAT
YOU NEED TO DECIDE
ARE YOU FOR FREE SPEECH
OR ARE YOU CONDEMNING ME FOR IT ?
stupid asshole
You mistake what condemns you. It isn't that you have free speech. It's that you are malevolent.
By your judgment you are judged. You will not find such vile insults in any of my posts or comments, so I do not merit condemnation. You condemn yourself.