An artist vs. the algorithms
I’m at a point where I’m wondering if it even makes sense to try and promote my work. The goal was to become fully sustainable from my work as an artist (fiction, podcasts, music). I don't know if trying to achieve that goal is even worth it at this point. In the end will it cost my passion for the work?
I feel like I’ve hit a ceiling.
I’ll do my best not to complain here, actually I feel fine, I’m just trying to figure out where to put my energy right now because it seems my effort is not having the effect I want it to have.
Trying to convince people to pay attention to my work doesn’t feel good. It doesn’t feel like what I’m here to do. And if there was a cumulative effect, if things were consistently going up, however slow, it might be easier to justify. They are not.
After the initial excitement (which is very small to begin with) of a new project, everything lulls down to near silence. Pushing my work on social media aggressively seems to register as a blip but it doesn't grow, and even if a few friends share my work, it never seems to stick anywhere.
That either means my work just isn’t interesting to people or it means it’s still not reaching the people its intended for, or reaching them the right way.
I've already tried catering to the masses and not catering to them at all, and I thought I found a happy middle place, but it becomes less and less effective over time because the algorithms seem to want you to be as simple as possible and to rally behind an existing culture rather than trying to be your own.
It's an uphill batter for people who aren't trying to fit in, no matter who they are and what they share.
Constantly sharing links doesn’t really feel right, it feels abusive. It feels like begging for something. Even if that’s not how I frame it, it feels forced.
The thing is I’m not even doing that much of it. If I were to stop doing it, my work wouldn’t reach anyone at all.
I could just share it at hive and forget about putting it elsewhere but we all know how quickly things disappear with a seven day payout window. I love Hive but i want to be open and available to other people outside of a single community. The way people interact with Hive content still doesn't make it a very good environment for timeless work.
On other platforms things were going pretty well for a while but the happier I become with my work, the more ruthless the algorithms became, and the harder it became to maintain people's interest.
I built up a small but meaningful following on both Twitter and YouTube, and some of these people even checked out my books and my podcast. Typically I got about 20-30 likes per tweet. Now I get about 3-5 most of the time (often the same hive friends). Whether this is because some people following me left when Musk took over, or whether it’s due to the change in the algorithm, this is discouraging. My primary reason for using the platform is to connect to people outside of Hive because I don’t have many other ways to do so.
I was getting 100-300 views per youtube video due to the algorithm recommending it, but now I get 5-10. Should I even bother?
I suspect all my problems on social media are due to the fact that I’m not hyper focused on a single topic. I’m also balancing a bunch of different projects so the algorithm gets confused. The typical solution would be to separate all of these projects on social media and to manage multiple accounts, but that would add a lot of extra unnecessary work and I’m not sure I have any more time to spend on managing accounts. If half of my time is spent managing social media, I’m not sure if it’s worth it.
I’m starting to wonder if I maybe don’t have what it takes to earn a living from creating the things I want to create, and if it’s really possible to reach the people I want to reach doing what comes naturally to me. I may just have to accept that I am nothing more than a hobbyist.
That’s a bit painful for me. I’d like to think I have what it takes and that one day I could earn my living doing the things i love, that i may actually reach people and be treated as the person I see myself, someone with important ideas, someone capable of healing through storytelling, conversation and song.
But the power of my work comes from the fact that it was inspired. I recieved it through becoming clean enough that i could serve as a vessel, by consistently following my excitement and healing myself and exploring. I did not achieve anything through the mindset of scarcity that told me I had to sacrficie doing things my way in order to achieve anything. I worked hard but mainly when it felt right and mainly when it felt like i was doing the work i wanted to be doing.
So something about promoting my work doesn’t feel right. It feels like I am feeding into unhealthy emotions like FOMO and addiction. Do i really want people to become addicted to my work, or do i want them to feel moved by it. These are not the same thing.
The fact is we are still living in a world where people are acting based on their fears and insecurities. Perhaps there is nothing truly wrong with this and its ok to play with those fears and insecurities in order to help heal them, but this is still not something that excites me, so perhaps I’m not the artist I think I am.
There are two kinds of artists who make it, who are able to live in abundance through their work, those who work to manipulate their audience, and those who are in the right place at the right time and have work thats brilliant enough to spread. I want to be the latter.
But being the latter means being willing to accept an extremely high chance of failure, of never being able to live comfortably from your work. For every great artist that makes it there are tens of thousands of geniuses who give up or who no one ever knows. There is a chance that no one appreciates you until you die or that you run out of energy and give up before you reach anyone.
There is also a chance that I’m just not good enough for anyone to want to pay money for.
Whats the purpose of reaching people anyway? Is it to change them? Aren’t I done doing things with expectations for a result? Don’t I want to make music for music’s sake? Don’t I want to make the podcasts with the intention of loving the whole process?
I’m trying to figure this all out and it’s inevitable that people taking interest makes me want to create more, and people not taking an interest leaves me wondering what do I truly enjoy.
I still don’t have an answer.
I am trying to find a way to be ok with however people react or don't react to my work, but I'm also wondering, if nobody cared and if there was no chance of earning a living from it, would I bother sharing anything, or would I just enjoy these ideas as they are in my head?
Is my energy inconsistent? Am I contracting myself in my behaviors? I am not sure so I'm spending some time to try and figure that out.
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I've had this same kind of existential questioning myself and I still haven't reached conclusive answers, but I don't think that you should stop doing what you love if you can survive while doing it. If you can't, then it's going to have to take second place to the essentials of day to day life, but keep on going - you'll never know unless you try.
I’ll never stop doing what I love. I think the questions becomes whether to bother sharing it and to what degree. Also should I really be putting any effort at all into social media where there is a chance a few people see it but less and less because algorithms. But thank you. Just hearing that gives me some energy
Social media is such a pain in the ass, to be honest it seems that it's becoming more and more difficult on conventional platforms to be noticed unless you pay for ads 🙄
I suppose it really comes down to why you are doing it - maybe do it more for yourself than for others if that makes sense? It's a tricky conundrum
Even paying for ads can have the opposite unless your content is addictive. I am more focused on actual quality than addictiveness so it’s really hard. It’s possible to be both but that’s a full time job! No thank you lol
I know the feeling though I have nothing to offer on this subject Sorry. Hope you find a way to get to your intended audience.
Have a great day!
Just stopping by is great support. Thank you always!
Sounds like you have talent but lack focus. You touched on this a few times throughout; how you do multiple things - podcasts, music, fiction - but think it's too much effort to separate things on different accounts etc to help the algorithm.
How many successful artists do you know who are musicians, writers and podcasters all in one? I'd bet either not many, or zero. Personally I'd make a decision on which one should be the main focus for success, and which two should be relegated to hobbies/passion projects. Then work your ass off for the one.
Unfortunately, art is as much of a business as it is an art. What is often never shown is just how much musicians work on the business side of things, analysing and studying algorithms, calculating finances and return on time investment, studying the markets to see what's in or out, crafting and compromising their own art to find a balance between filling a niche, and filling a demand.
For example, the 'short form' curse on our culture thanks to things like TikTok is what people want nowadays. How can one make this work in their music career without making any compromise? Well, they can't. Compromise is necessary whether it's short form or anything else that changes in the coming years such as whatever apocalyptic results come from AI's new domination.
But there are ways to make the short form work, as a form of advertisement to bring people to your channel. As long as I watch something to the end, whether I like it or not, I'm gonna see more of it for the next few days unless I start skipping quickly.
So logically you just need to make something that keeps people engaged for at least 15 seconds or whatever.
If music; what kind of visual element can complement that? Is a new skill needed such as motion graphics, photoshop? A LOT of musicians have these skills now because nobody wants to discover music that isn't a meme at this point.
What else can one do with a podcast to make short clips, other than simply cutting out an interesting segment and posting it?
It goes on.
In short: Find out what people want, what the algorithms truly want, and how you can apply your work to those without sacrificing your own style.
Focus on one. The rest can come back later if needed.
Work out how much time - perhaps even to the minute - you can reasonably dedicate to that one, and maximize it.
Perhaps more importantly, don't stop. Some of the huge influences out there got barely no attention for 10-12 years before they blew up
It’s funny. I kind of look at Elon Musk as a success story for doing all these different projects successfully, never mind the level of arrogance I have to think I’m talented enough to achieve anything even close, even with something less physically impactful on the world.
But you’ve highlighted something that I know but keep forgetting. Not all of my projects need to be earning money for me to live on my art. Rather than trying to succeed a little bit on all of them, it’ll probably be a lot more effective to focus on succeeding with one first. And while I don’t know if any major compromises are absolutely necessary to make money from my work, I better be willing to accept failure if I’m not willing to make those compromises, because they make success a whole lot easier and nothing is gauranteed.
I think a lot of my frustration stems from social media. I actually spent a lot of time to learn the algorithms and work with them (what i saw as the compromise and grind that i was ok with) but as soon as Musk came in at twitter, all the momentum was lost and it’s been really hard to recover. I tried adapting and even tried to buy that dumb checkmark. I took out ads and all that. Everything had the opposite effect. I think I am still coming at it from what I want to make rather than what the market wants… to be honest, that approach makes me feel like it might be better to seek my well-being through other means, like maybe I need to accept not being able to quit my day-job for a long time, or maybe ever.
I appreciate your advice a lot and I’ll keep thinking about if there is any kind of artist grind that I might actually be willing to work at, but on the other hand I kinda feel like maybe I should shut up about earning money from art and just appreciate the fact that I can make a few dollars from this post. I’ve never cashed out so the hive earnings have never really felt real to me, even after 6 years. Maybe its time i give myself a bonus.
I think a strong enough connection to community can bypass some of the issues of social media and trends, but for that I’ll have to build up the energy to go out and do more. That combined with lower expectations and keeping some of what you’ve said in mind, I think it’ll be fine.
I still have a lot of thinking to do.
I think a lot of the social media algorithm BS is really pretty good as a tool for marketing. Pander enough to get the audience pulled in. When you're at a good point, spread out introducing who you really are.
Sacrifice doesn't have to be forever.
Imagine you're that person in a busy ballroom trying to grab everyone's attention by tapping a wine glass with a knife, but nobody is listening, so you briefly change who you are to stand on a table and yell like a gorilla. When everybody turns round in surprise, you then return to you and say 'right, as I was saying, dinner's ready' or whatever.
Also, I wonder if you actually follow people who do similar work to yourself. That's one of the best ways to learn by mimicking their success. Hope to see you climb! There's no rush
Thanks man. Yeah it was working pretty well on twitter and now it’s not. I think I just need to choose one focus there but I guess I’ll take a break for a bit because I lost it anywa. Regroup!
Van Gogh only became known posthumously. It happened to a lot of people, didn't it? The time for superficial things will eventually be over. In fact, humanity can no longer afford it. But until then, those ahead of their time fall through the grid, or algorithm. And if I'll see the day when the world community can leave the greed for profit and power behind? I doubt it lol.
Yeah I always think about that. I don’t want to be him 😆 I want to feel a positive feedback loop between my work and my relationship with the world. I think I need to figure out more what’s motivating me on different levels before I make a decision about how to move forward.
I hear you. Questioning oneself and the world, I think that is the next level period. Too many figure out that what they told us the last decades is a big lie and we all have to come back to a realistic approach on life. The greed for success is destroying our mental health, cuz who defines success? Lately few people/companies right? Behind the scenes. They only pretend to do good, but it's just pure hypocrisy because the real motivation is greed for more. More money, more power and shareholder satisfaction. This is the apocalypse of mankind 😅.
What's wrong with being a Vincent? ;^)
It was good to be signposted to your post here, by @vincentnijman 's tagging your article, dear @selfhelp4trolls - really great sharing, and great questions you're asking: I set up this Art. community with many of the questions you ask in mind. I've asked myself many of them too, as my online presence began to decline dramatically in recent years - and after 35 + years of hard slog as an artist, carving out my 'identity' and scarbbling for crumbs!
I hope you'll join us there and be supported by the good vibes and connections: I have much to respond to in your post, but don't want to overdo it! So much of what you're saying is being experienced by every kind of creative who is making unique stuffs; ultimately, the algorithms are designed to filter out Truth, and so anything truly original is also hidden. I am seeing small creative businesses everywhere being affected hugely by this: the internet as it exists is effectively blacklisting us, or subtley censoring us.
However, and even though I've reached the point in recent years of almost giving up my lifelong calling to Art., it has become clear that my whole previous comprehension about audience-celebrity/ artist relationship was completely skewed. As my 'public' diminished, I recognised where the folks who'd been supporting me had been doing so very superficially -or even, they had some kind of morbid codependent presumption about me and what they were 'buying' from me.
I moved out of transactional and contractional work dynamics - slowly but surely - beginning a few years ago, and now 'sell' literally nothing. I have a small and perfectly formed group of very special folks who resonate with what I do; some of them support my via Hive and crypto here, some are my blessed monthly supporters on Patreon, some support me in kind/ randomly/ spontaneously/ in person, and I get a lot of what I need either freely from nature or bartering or cheaply from secondhand markets.
My need for buying new things has diminished, obviously, with my dwindling income! But this was a temporary stress, as my shift into symbiosis with my environment and community meant that everythign I needed came to be regardless of how much money I had. In fact, the less money I was earning, the more I had access to in season local food: the less I had inkling or appetite for things and experiences beyond the immediate realm I live in... Everything changed, and my vitality and focus were transformed for expontentially greater wellbeing - and continues to do so.
This led me to take a lot of time out from my usual Art. practise, and to review what I had achieved as well as what my expectations were of my work's presence and purpose in the world. Through profound conversations with very close friends, like @exoexplorer , @theastone and @vincentnijman - especially in our weekly Co-Creation Sessions, I came to a place of divine peace around what it is to be co-creator rather than the cultural definition of 'art-ist'. I am never looking back: stepping out of the drama and confusion of our role as conventional 'art-ists' is powerfully liberating, as the structures of the world very necessarily have to crumble, and new more organic forms aligned with Nature take their place.
Sending you huge encouragement to keep creating and keep postitive about how it will work out. Letting go of scarcity mentality is a huge task, and we all will be challenged by it, sooner or later: behind the mythology of there not-being-enough of anything/ everything, and behind the algorithms and censorship, there are folks like us recognising that WE hold ALL the POWER, and that no system or corporation can get between us and each other, or between us supporting and uplifting each other!
Much love to you 😍
Ahhhhhh shit. Meant to reply to this but wanted to give it a proper reply. I will try to now but just in case I don’t finish , here’s a temporary reply !
I’ve been following you on and off for a while now, and I’m always impressed. It’s only on and off cause there is way too much to follow these days, and we haven’t actually spoken yet. The pregnancy, the house, the weekly art jams (been thinking about doing something in the physical like this for a while now).
I don’t really see technology or even the algorithms as a bad thing, I just don’t like how much power we’ve given them over our lives and I’m trying to reorient myself more on the physical as well as in intentional online communities these days (so I will join the art jam whenever I can, putting it on my calendar since I’m trying to use one of those these days)
I spent about 3 years trying to live using only the concept of a gift economy. I would use money but only earned through Free-pricing and only $200 usd a month in a city that usually costs people $2000 a month. I got very tired of the living conditions so I went back into society a bit while trying to fix my whole foundation.
It’s funny. Now I’m not really in society but I’m not really out of it either. I kind of like it, able to live in both worlds, I feel free to enter the arenas of office workers and whatever people might consider “normies” and I can live in squats and eco villages. I like going back and forth although the ultimate goal is to liberate myself to a greater degree and I assume and hope (while trying to reserve expectations) that I will help others do the same in the process.
I am not sure what needs to crumble and what needs to transform, all I know is that change is inevitable and love begets love (beget! 😆 first time I used that word!) and the deeper I dig into myself the more I learn about the world, so I keep digging 🔥
Ithink one of the challenges is these companies know what’s shifting in the landscape with television dying and internet content growing more profitable. That means unless you pay the gatekeepers you won’t get your content discovered as easily if it shifts around a bit as you said it does. I don’t know what the best solution would be but it’s a good idea to keep at it but also work a job that pays the bills so you can have multiple sources of income until the one you want takes over.
I feel like social media is already totally dominated by people who optimize for success at social media which means treating it as WORK. I thought there were still a few cracks where it might not be like that but I’m starting to feel it’s not even worth looking for it. I can just copy and paste certain things I share at hive on social media and focus more on hive and discord and IRL. I don’t really want to give myself an extra job with twitter and YouTube. If it’s not fun it’s really not worth it. I might have earned 4000 usd in hive last year? How much time and effort of doing much less fun work polishing everything to be shiny and addictive would it take to earn that at YouTube? Years probably. The exponential growth from there is the only benefit of using those platforms and it’s so unlikely, I’d rather stick to a new linear plan