Seeking Recognition
It's somehow disheartening to hear an argument like "yeah, but they are not real money" related to cryptocurrency from skeptics, when the majority of money spending and transfers are now online, when crypto is a talking point of the Biden-Trump debates (and Trump goes to a crypto conference), when the biggest asset manager in the world is deeply involved in the space and the majority of Fortune 500 companies has or will have onchain projects.
And yet, crypto still seeks recognition in the real world. It is the future, but not yet the present, at least not enough. Yes, of all coins, Bitcoin has a brand of its own and sometimes it is used interchangeably with "crypto" by people who are not familiar with the space.
I'm not sure how many of the bitcoiners think of it as "money" and how many only as an asset to hold that increases in value over time. The argument on the proponents of bitcoin as "money" is that it will become one when prices will be set in bitcoin and not in USD. There is the counter-argument that the fixed nature of the bitcoin supply doesn't help sustain the elasticity of the economy, to which they usually reply that it would solve the problem of inflation. We'll see how this goes...
Where I wanted to reach was that even bitcoin still needs to fight every step of the way, for every small or big victory. To some degree, its victories are wins for the entire space, but in many cases each ecosystem and project has a fight to fight.
The best counter-argument to "yeah, but they are not real money" is to show them cases where it acts as real money. But there is a catch. When to use it in the real economy you need to convert it to fiat money, the skeptics still have something to cling on and accept that certain coins have real value.
One way to clear (some) doubts is to "throw money" at the world in a way that places the spender in a favorable light. This way you show that the "money is real" and can sustain a big(ger) project in the real world, that can be seen, touched, used, enjoyed, etc. Sometimes the marketing is not for the masses, but for potential investors.
Consider the Hive-funded rally car. I've looked at it as a way to market to the masses for a long time. As such, it is a poor way to spend money when there are other cheaper advertising methods that would likely have better results. And I've seen other people express discontent about this potentially unjustified spending.
What if...? What if the main target of this advertising is not the masses, the public, but the rich people around these cars (not as in F1, but still someone funds all these cars and drivers, many at a higher class than the Hive-funded car)? You never know who would like to drop 100k in buying HIVE. The question is how will they get it because, well, we aren't so easy to reach by big money...
I still don't know if the cost is justified or not, I've seen other sponsors started to show up on the car (@pfunk is one of them), so they are probably thinking how to reduce costs for Hive while keeping the car going.
There are other areas where if we do the math as accountants Hive is throwing money out the window. In some cases, it might be true, so it's important to see both pros and cons, but in other cases the end goal might be higher than number of new users but the talent of new users or a certain use case that is desired to be incentivized.
For example, like others, I also thought after a while that the prizes + votes that go to the VIBES community every week are kind of high. The question is, would the new users who come through this contest stick around without the incentives? I don't know, but I do know that most people love music, and having this kind of content tied to Hive on X and Hive helps.
When we do exact calculations, some things won't make sense. Interestingly, if we would be able to use HBD to pay for a concert ticket, I doubt we would calculate the return on that HBD. Sure, we might gauge the effectiveness of that spending after seeing if we enjoyed or not the concert. But not everything can be judged in terms of ROI. For example, the boreholes in Ghana.
Yes, we can analyze if we can afford this or that spending or if we can afford it at a certain time, that makes sense to put under the microscope sometimes.
We often complain that Hive is ignored, shadowbanned, etc. Maybe the solution is not to complain, and do what everyone else does: pay, if it's worth it.
IMO, that's a ridiculous argument... If there is no inflation, the economy would be very much stagnant... especially in the last decade or so... Speaking of Europe, and probably the USA where there is no increment in population, there is no reason for growing economies... "Elasticity" of the economy is artificially made to "simulate" growth...
And regarding HIVE thoughts... I think that we are still immature as a network to play with the big guys, and big spending, like raising "brand awareness" (as rally car is that) is too early to do atm... People would like to see HIVE pump to 10$, and everyone using HBD for payments NOW or the latest tomorrow, but that can't happen so fast and we need more time...
But, not to just wait for something to happen, but to innovate on HIVE, build new stuff, find new use cases, etc. In the end, UNDERSTAND HIVE better, as many Hivians who are here still have no idea how it works, and all the good things about HIVE... Hive is more than getting paid for blogging, taking funds from DHF to get "free money", and cashing out on day 1... If we are failing to educate people who are here on HIVE for 2-3, or more years about the benefits of HIVE, how can we expect that someone else will come, and buy 100K USD worth of HIVE?
I sound a bit pessimistic, but we should look at ourselves, be better, create a more friendly atmosphere around us, and lead by example... Somehow, I have a feeling that we have fewer true leaders in our community compared to before... Time to build up new leaders?
Tbh, stagnant economy sounds kind of bad. Let's take the example close to home. Why does Hive want more users? To stay relevant in the social media space, even more than for economic purposes. You said Europe and maybe US would have been stagnant without inflation. Ok, let's assume they are stagnant. What happens if China grows? Don't they need to grow to keep things in balance? Or at least that's how the geopolitics game seems to be played.
They actually did and do. We have a few whales that built up sharply way after Hive was formed, and they keep coming, for reasons they know and we may assume from their actions (we also have whales that left). Let's also remember that Splinterlands whales are often ignorant to Hive, but some aren't and have built up some stash and their knowledge about the ecosystem and base protocol. Give them a reason and they might become whales on Hive too.
Are we immature to play with big boys? We are around since 2016, and other projects play with big boys since their draft of a whitepaper and no product. We might be too late to play with them.
We will never be able to convey all the values of Hive to everyone. Each user takes from Hive what they want and like. They understand as much as they want and get involved accordingly. We don't really have a well-defined brand since we started going in different directions, but if a brand is strong enough it will catch, we don't need to teach new users about the principles we stand for every time. They will be interested in them. Plus, these principles are kind of depending from platform to platform. The level of decentralization, censorship resistance, ownership, differs from platform to platform and from person to person. If someone has a lite account and never bothers to take ownership of a full Hive account, they might not have the same level of ownership as full account owners. Splinterlands players and investors think of Hive in a certain way, Inleo threaders in a different way and Inleo posters differently, just to give a few examples.
That might be true. Either that or they work behind the scenes. But I tend to believe some left and there is a void to be filled.
Huh... don't know where to start first... When I re-read my comment, I realized that I wasn't clear enough and you misunderstood what I wanted to say... anyway... The point of "growth" was that it more "looks like a growth" in numbers, while those numbers are measured in USD which is devaluating...
Exactly... Give them a reason... I don't want to sound like a person who FUD, but there is a space outside HIVE... people are building things, innovating... Just want to say that we are kind of in the "slow phase" of development... As you said, in the moment of forming HIVE we had that peak of euphoria, which we used to push things, but it changed... And that's fine too, as we need to think with a cold head...
I'm not sure if you misunderstood that point too... I didn't say that we have to educate SPL players on how to blog, or bloggers how to do De-Fi on Hive, but rather serve information that is asked for... Bloggers to teach about specifics on HIVE, as it is NOT like other social media... SPL guys about gaming, and maybe show other games too, etc...
Maybe HIVE looks easy for you and me, but it's definitely not easy for a newbie to find different information about it... Network hub that will funnel new Hivians in the area that they are interested...
Anyway... I will repeat myself again 100x times... we need more dialogue to push through... and I hope the next HiveFest and similar events could provide a "platform" for that... As a decentralized blockchain, dialogue is our main tool...
Great post and great discussion... I was thinking of creating a post on all this... Maybe I will... Got an inspiration... :) Thanks!!
Well, if growth is higher than the rate of inflation, then it is real growth. But I agree, inflation gives a false sense of growth in the numbers.
I agree with you on this one. And too few centers of active development on Hive at the moment.
But there are! Maybe not as many to teach about Hive, but so many teaching Splinterlands. The problem is many do it outside Hive (like on Twitch or whatever). Regarding people teaching about Hive, this is only one new account that is focused on that: @encouragement .
Indeed! That is missing a lot compared to the past! At least on the chain level.
Looking forward to it! I bet you have lots to say as well. I feel I got you going a bit, which is great! This heat can make us wanting to sleep all day.
I would disagree with you about the stagnant economy without inflation. To quote the Bitcoin Standard: "Sound money allows people to think about the long-term and to save and invest more for the future. Saving and investing for the long run are the key to capital accumulation and the advance of human civilization."
Hmmm... I don't understand your point of view... I have probably used the wrong words, as I didn't say that it's better or worse without inflation, it was just a POV that the numbers are rigged...
So, in a way, what you say would push the economy forward... which I do agree with... I never understood the point of NGU ideology... If we would have stable money, why would we have to go up... Human greed?
Yes, makes sense. It is exciting times ahead I think as we have a whole generation who have bought cheap assets and need to sell them on to the younger generation, but if you look at the stats, the young generation have over 25% crypto allocation, so they not gonna buy the overpriced houses and stocks. At the same time, it is probably the Boomers who are buying Bitcoin through the ETFs.
In reality, I'm all for the car rally as well as the Vibes contest, I just think the constancy of them are just the problem. For example the vibes contests can be once in a month or once in 3 months and maybe reduced prizes.
We have really smart people on the chain and it'll be good to target people with really good proposals that can yield results.
I think the problem is yielding results and that's what Hive really needs
I understand your reasoning and, as I said in the post, I also feel they are kind of high. They might be worried of losing their interest if they are too rare. I would try at least be-weekly or a smaller one at the half of the month and a bigger one at the end of the month, where entries from the smaller one are added again by default (to incentivize people to participate in the smaller one).
Yes, you are, but others aren't. :)
I tend to believe some of the results are not communicated properly (inward), but they exist. In some cases, maybe better KPI is needed. The current strategy of communication seems to be mainly outward, which is one reason why I felt the need to create the Week through Adrian's Lenses series.
Your weekly lens is how I got to learn a lot too. However they aim to make the contests, I think the aim should be balancing what goes out with what comes in to at least 50/50. The initiative is good is just that they can be well balanced to yield better visible results.
I guess it depends on how you "count" the returns. If it's money, it's easy. Money in, on one side. Money out, on the other. If it's new users, do their skills, talents, and desire to get involved count as a separator or we treat them all the same way. How about retention? Some number of new users can be easy to attract, but if they drop out, they become a dead weight for the chain.
I think you can already use Bitcoin as a currency for storing value and paying. Just the same as when you travel abroad, you just convert your home currency to the foreign one that they receive. At some point fiat currencies will be irrelevant and everything will be priced in Bitcoin as it will be the new denominator, it's not a numerator.
Well, if you put it like that, yes, it is. But as long as prices are in USD, would you prefer to pay with bitcoin? Maybe at the end of the bull market, but even then, in the long term, bitcoin should be worth more.
Isn't it better if things are priced in USD? I feel I'm getting a discount as Bitcoin keeps going up against it... 21M / ∞
If prices are in USD and you spend BTC, then you give away future gains of BTC, while if you pay with USD, that doesn't happen, instead you don't lose value of the spent USD to inflation. So in most cases it would be preferable to pay in USD if BTC were to continue going up cycle after cycle.
That's only true imo if you use USD as a store of value. The only way you lose future bitcoin gains is to choose to spend it rather than hodl.
Wasn't this the point of the whole conversation? Using bitcoin as money?
Crypto's evolving role is very very interesting, especially with increasing real-world integration. Big Organizations and companies are now adopting it and it only shows a bright future of Hive.I appreciate your perspective on HIVE's growth brother
The integration of crypto into various businesses seems closer and closer by the day. That's something we mostly dreamed about one cycle before.
It's going to be a great crypto future
You're right, spend money the right way if you want to attract interest to our quirky group here on Hive. Investing wisely in areas that people will take note is important, is the rally car good use or advertising? Time will tell, but at least they're trying, and that I respect!
I agree. It's actually very easy to criticize (I know, I've done it a few times, lol), not as easy to try to accomplish something especially when the odds are against you.
I think that is an interesting view. I think there was a point where one community did run music shows for artists and you could pay HBD to get a ticket. I think that shut down not long after so I don't really know if the system works that well. I do think that money talks quite a bit when it comes with people.
I read a recent post about paid loyalty by @josediccus which can be seen as a proof that money aligns interests in many cases. Interesting read! And likely valid both for personal and for business relationships, to a good degree, in our society.
Definitely pros and cons to it and I think there's a nuanced view on how to get recognition. Maybe we want it too soon, when we've not proofed ourselves enough yet. It might take some time for us to collectively realize that "real money" has evolved in definition and it's no longer exclusive to paper money that we can earn and spend on real world utilities.
The deciders in the world are still mostly entrenched in that world, mostly due to their age and the way they were educated and lived their lives and understand the world. Is the new and better technology replacing the old one eventually, historically speaking? Yes, most of the times. But some do get buried and reinvented many years or even centuries later.
To ensure the success of revolutionizing technology, it has to have awareness and eventually gain favorable sentiments of the public, influencers, and deciders. Otherwise it falls into obscurity. Either that, or they have to outlast the deciders and wait until mentalities change at the top.
Rightly said! Sometimes it takes a generational change for such technologies to reach mass adoption and be developed to their full potential. Now we're only experiencing the prelude of what these inventions are capable of and to me it looks really promising.
I think there's also some element of brainwashing, in the sense that what can actually help people to take more control or ownership of their digital lives in general is looked unfavourably by the very sources of information we generally default to.
Absolutely! Why do you think these ETFs are pushed so hard and they are trying to make self-custody illegal or at least block transactions to and from self-custody wallets anywhere it matters? I don't think they'll succeed, but it's enough to scare some people away.